Now, Bung, you don't have to jump on the hate wagon.

As far as calling him, "I'm a gonna troll", as long as that is all he does, that is his name.

As far as war. Until you serve, you really have not enough insight to understand. I would rather that the "tons of people getting blown up" are terrorists in Iraq, rather than tons of innocent New York citizens being pulverized again.

The Biblical attitude is not that all death is wrong. All of us die. In fact, a believer who dies is wonderful in God's eyes, because they are now in Heaven with Him. The true understanding of the Commandment, "THou shalt not kill" is, You shall not murder. The execution of a serial murderer is justified in Biblical view. The commission of war to defend a country is justified.

I am too tired to debate.

Sensei Ern

Yeah, because we all know the Iraqi governemt is directly responsible for September 11. And every person dead over there is a filthy terrorist. We all know Iraq is definetely the most threatening nation to us. The nation that is rumored to have a few chemical weapons, which couldn't be used on us (think about how they could launch one to get here) is much more dangerous than a nation with nukes wich hates us also.We are the world police and it is our duty to force our morals and beliefs on other nations.

Don't feed me the world is safer without Saddam whopper. Yeah, the world would also be safer without Dubya, too.

Well said. Well said, indeed.

The group we are fighting in Iraq are the people who would do another 9/11 to us. As I stated, they are not Iraqs for the most part.

They are terrorists from other countries who came to aid Saddam because they saw an opportunity to attack the U.S. We are meeting them there, instead of doing aftermath investigations in the rubble of another U.S. building.

This could be a pissing contest instead of a debate, so set the conditions of the debate. I don't want a pissing contest. I want dialog that could work towards one of us being convinced that the other has a valid point. Aside from Bush leaving office, what conditions would need to be met before you would be convinced that the war in Iraq is justified?

Sensei Ern

The war in Iraq, in the long run will benefit hungry and oppressed Iraqis. Millions of people who live in Iraq will be free from the oppression that their ruler had forced upon them. Under the rule of Saddam Hussein hunger was rampant his enemies were being murdered without reason or a fare trial. Now with the U.S occupation the people of Iraq are free from the harsh dictatorship of Hussein. Before the invasion Iraq posed a serious threat to the United States and its allies. As Dr. William Sjostrona, a senior lecturer in economics at the Center for Applied Social Policy at UCC, says, “The danger is clear: using chemical, biological or, one day nuclear weapons obtained with the help of Iraq, the terrorists could fulfill their stated ambitions and kill thousands of people.”
The common people of Iraq were starved of food when Hussein was in power. He didn’t care about his people enough to step down so that the economic sanctions that the U.N. had placed on Iraq would be removed. Some might say that with the introduction of the Oil-for-Food program the Iraqis would not be hungry any more, but Hussein still found a way to cheat his people. He stole the money that he oil generated to use it for his own enjoyment by purchasing palaces, yachts, etc.
As Steve Pickering a spring intern with the Washington Peace Letter says, “The history of Iraq under Saddam Hussein is one of harsh oppression, with widespread abuses of human rights, and frequent torture and murder of political opponents, or just those who displease him. Political rights such as freedom of assembly, expression and movement are denied in Iraq. Summary arrests and executions are carried out, while civilians of Turkoman and Kurdish origin continue to be ousted from the cities of Kirkuk, Khanakin and Douz.” But some might say, “Why don’t the people of Iraq protest this harsh treatment?” Many have tried but without the help of the United States all attempts failed.
Iraq is a great threat to the U.S. as President Bush says, “The treat comes from Iraq. It arises directly from the Iraqi regime’s own actions -- its history of aggression and its drive toward an arsenal of terror. Eleven years ago, as a condition for ending the Persian Gulf War, the Iraqi regime was required to destroy its weapons of mass destruction, to cease all development of such weapons, and to stop all support for terrorist groups. The Iraqi regime has violated all of those obligations. It possesses and produces chemical and biological weapons. It is seeking nuclear weapons. It has given shelter and support to terrorism, and practices terror against its own people.” Some people might argue, “Why don’t we just invade all the nations that have Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) like Iran.” Well Iran was not the country that invaded Kuwait it was Iraq acting by itself.
Even though the Iraq War has cost thousands of lives, in the long run the cost will out weigh the benefits. First, under the rule of Hussein hunger was rampant in common folk, they had barley enough food to live. Second, Iraqis had no political rights now that U.S. soldiers liberated them. They will soon receive the rights that they so long awaited for. Third, under the dictatorship of Hussein Iraq posed a great threat to the United States and its allies. So everyone support the war in Iraq.

I think you mean:
Even though the Iraq War has cost thousands of lives, in the long run the cost will be out weighed by the benefits. First, under the rule of Hussein hunger was rampant in common folk, they had barley enough food to live. Second, Iraqis had no political rights until now, that U.S. soldiers liberated them. They will soon receive the rights that they so long waited for.


Not criticizing, just clarifying

wow never saw that thanks!

Well, I've never been for war. Killing of innocent children and women in poor huts is not something I can fully accept for any cause. I mean who needs to use napalm bombs on roads to fight terrorists? It's a little much don't you think?

I do stand corrected. I understand that in my pro-active approach to generating tolerance I come off as over-bearing. I will be much more selective in my pictures for now on, because I wan't to have as harmonious an experience on these forums as maintstream lifestlye members.

Hope there's no hard feelings though

Going back to the draft briefly..now that Bush is back in, if our soldiers keep fighting over there, who will replace them? Neither Kerry or Bush really said anything about that- okay, maybe I'm lying, I didn't really watch the debates cos I was either tired or whatever. I'm really scared about the fact that the draft could come about again, even though Bush said he wouldn't, or whatever. We all know politicians lie, because let's face it. We ALL lie.
I don't support war, either, imago. I actually have a peace ring that I wear everyday, since the eight grade I think. My friend Elly was telling me about how she ate in an older diner, and they had this old sign up that said Bring our Boys Home..it's really profound and when you think about it, it's really sad. A lot more than just sad. What's even worse is the people dying now..like one guy who lived near me was in Drexel, going somewhere with his life. That's just one person out of so many. It's crazy.

OKay, my brain has officailly died for tonight..I won't babble on because it won't make any sense after right now.